Apr 19, 2022·edited Apr 19, 2022Liked by Graham Seibert
" justifying a declaration of war ..." Just what exactly is it that Russians have been doing since February 24? Looks an awful lot like a war, which is definitely a kind of a "special military operation." All wars and invasions are special military operations, the Normandy Invasion was a very special military operation. They weren't shooting teddy bears out of their artillery, and people were getting wounded and dying on the other end. It's rather like arguing with an alcoholic, you begin to feel a little crazy when they get you into the way which they see things, which is a crazy, screwed up way, with little or no connection to on-the-ground reality. Perhaps Vlad is a "king-sized" psychopath - and the "useful fools" who hang around him and make excuses and defend him are the sorts you always see around psychopaths and bullies, they're the enablers who pile on, if the think they see some perceived advantage. Usually the psychopath or bully treats them as disposable, they *know* they are disposable, and their character is so weak that they suck up continuously to the psychopath or bully. It's good to find out who these people actually are, because they're trash, and dangerous trash at that... It never fails to amaze me that so many American "conservatives" buy this Russian propaganda hook, line, and sinker - this is where politicization of issues gets you, averring the opposite of what your political opponent avers, without looking at the situation and giving it a good close examination can really lead you down the wrong path on this - and *I* was wrong in *my* initial assessment, until the English translation of Dugin's Foundations of Geopolitics came out - here, for reference: https://n01r.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/Foundations-of-Geopolitics-Geopolitical-Future-of-Russia-Alexander-Dugin-English-auto-translation-with-appended-original.pdf - if readers of this comment haven't read it, I suggest they do, and then pass it on to "conservative" friends who have been suckered by the Russians - it kicked my ass right out of bed, a literal "oh shit" moment... seeing that it had been written 25 years ago. Not only was this invasion unprovoked, it was *planned*, and extensively so, and Putin was just waiting for a weak American President to come along...
Apr 19, 2022·edited Apr 19, 2022Liked by Graham Seibert
"It never fails to amaze me that so many American "conservatives" buy this Russian propaganda hook, line, and sinker."
Simple, because many conservatives are used to the total BS spouted by the democrats and their enablers in the press, on Covid, Racism, Sexuality, etc. The real shame is that we can't trust the media. Boy who cried wolf, and all that.
I don't know any of my conservative friends who spout Russian positions on this war. I see Carlson worried that the US will actively enter the war sending US troops. He asserts that those evil Democrats want to send troops. Worry about the prospect is fine because there is great public compassion for Ukraine's pain. But I think it unlikely given the stakes. And Trump's pronouncements are simply political in his belief that Putin would have behaved if Trump were in charge. That might actually be true but we shall never know. Clearly Putin underestimated Ukraine's resistance and could not have foreseen the world response to his invasion. The West has responded with a large supply of arms further enabling a real proxy war.
The politicians and media will do as they wish to sow division but I sense huge public support for Ukraine and not much for Putin. I suspect that the Russia public will eventually learn the truth given the scope of Russian losses. New dissidents are likely to arrive to replace those jailed by Putin. It's tragic what Putin has done to his people as well as his harms on Ukraine people. All because he wasn't winning in the Donbas.
Typical conservative: a noun a verb and tHe mEdiA!!11!! + it's the Democrats' fault that we're gullible idiots who believe fascists and liars. Funny how the "party of personal responsibility" will never take responsibility for their own failures. All of us have access to the same media, yet it's only Trump trash falling for Putin's bs. Hmmm.
Lying Republicans and their lying, racist Putin propagandists at Fox News have lied constantly about vaccines, about their white supremacy, about Trump's election loss, about the books and history they're banning.
The real shame is that right wing morons actually trust lying bigots like Tucker Carlson and Donald Trump. The good thing is young voters don't trust lying right wing media hacks, and that the GQP is finished once Boomer geriatrics die off over the next decade.
Sad to be so lacking in decency and morals you're making desperate excuses for lying, white supremacist Putin-puppets like Donald Trump and Tucker Carlson, whose conservative propaganda is being played on Russian state TV to justify Putin's illegal war.
Imagine twisting yourself into knots to defend those two, then pretending to be against "generalization" when the Carlson-Trump Fox News right has turned demonized generalization of "liberals" and "the media" into a national sport. Spare me the phony, hypocritical selective outrage.
well it's not news. it's a polemic against russians. and we don't need that. 99% of the citizens on both sides are good people, good enough anyway, normal, like you and I. And that needs to be remembered and peace needs to be promoted for their sakes. or at least for the sakes of their children.
the villain who do bad things are villains and you can abuse and vilify them.
But we don't need the fires of war stoked by the USA or anyone else
and we don't need whole peoples abused and condemned for what they've got little or no control over. It doesn't help a bit.
Lying is a theme that runs throughout Russian history. Every book I have reviewed discussed it. It has characterized most of the people who rose to power in Russia. This is not a matter of stoking fires, simply noting facts that many others have described. As we attempt to end this conflict, we have to understand our adversary as he is.
well that's it, right there: who is 'our adversary' ? Anyone advocating war, that's who.
Lying, I think you might find, is somewhat universal. England was known as 'perfidious Albion' I believe. That paragon of virtue and home of the mother of parliaments.
The USA currently has a truly exceptional list of lies to its name, I think.
The point, of course, is that neither the English nor the Americans - nor any other people - are really extraordinary or exceptional liars.
But of course you don't talk of the people, only of their 'leaders'.
Well I think the same can be said of them.
For it is a solid fact that diplomacy is the art of lying, of deception, is it not? You'd perhaps have read Coleman's 'Diplomacy by Deception' ?
My sole interest is to counter attempts to demonise whole peoples, is all. These wars are not of and by the people. Know it or not the people are merely manipulated puppets.
I wonder how you arrived at that statistic? I would imagine it compares with similar statistics around the world, like USA and Australia, that 80% of their people are in accord with their govt. actions re covid.
i.e. mainly an unfounded and worthless statistic.
When 'founded' it's generally founded on people who say 'yes' as a knee jerk reaction and pain avoidance strategy: don't contradict the prevailing narrative, don't talk about things you don't know about/care about, don't appear to have an argument with the govt.
BUT: even if all those people did condone the govt actions on covid (to stick to that parallel) it still wouldn't mean those people ARE as their government would it?
It wouldn't mean they would want to mask everyone in the clear absence of any proof of efficacy (the people are unaware of that). It wouldn't mean they want to ban use of proven medications. It wouldn't mean they want to spend billions and run up the national debt (most of them have no idea its happening) - would it?
They are not their leaders.
No people anywhere in the world are as their leaders are.
Your inference, whether you are aware of it or not, is that 80% of Russians are lying murderous people.
In the USA, Aus. etc, Covid context you'd claim 80% of those people were conniving, thieving, irrational, freedom destroying madmen. ( or women ).
Which they're not. You know that.
Hating a whole people ain't right and it don't fix.
I notice that you do not write "Most Russians oppose this war" or "Most Russians oppose Putin." You can't write that, because you know most Russians support Putin and his war. That makes them complicit, no matter how much you do not like it, because you don't like what that says about their lack of decency and morals.
"Hating a whole people" isn't me telling the uncomfortable truth about the viciousness, cruelty, and dishonesty in Russian culture under Putin that has led a supermajority of Russian people to support Putin's war.
"Hating a whole people" is what Russia's troops are doing to innocent civilians in Ukraine.
"In the USA, Aus.m etc, COVID context" is not relevant: the subject is Putin's evil, illegal war in Ukraine, not your desperate attempt to change the subject to deny the fact that most Russians support Putin, Putin's lies, Putin's hate, and Putin's violence.
That ~80% of Russians support Putin's vile actions is proven by polling and by the fact that Russians continue to vote for him. Again and again and again. Go to the @whitehouse Instagram page. Filled with comments from Russians in lockstep support of Putin.
Where are the Russians protesting the war? Where are the Russians planning to vote against Putin? Nowhere. We are waiting.
Every stray traveler to Mother Muscovy (Russia is a stolen term applied to this area since late 18th century) attested no morals and nor scruples, blatant lying and stealing and robbing, along with murder, whenever convenient. Same as did most of Russian writers of the 19th century (the 1st century of Russian literature). Just like Russian soldiers did traditionally, and continue to do at EVERY opportunity. And yet, here we are again, mulling the enigma of the Russian soul. I say it as a matter of fact, with no ill intent.
" . . . and we don't need whole peoples abused and condemned for what they've got little or no control over."
I understand where you are coming from, and my guts are turning over every time I see images of the carnage. I cross myself and say 'Lord have Mercy' for every life that has been lost. I also understand that, in order to be able to kill the enemy, one must first dehumanize them. "Ukrainians are Nazis." "Russians are subhuman monsters." Etc. ad nauseum.
Simple folks like you and I (and every Ukrainian refugee I've met in Germany) want this stopped as soon as possible. We just want to go home.
But don't underestimate the anger and justifiable desire for revenge against the side that fired the first shots.
It's true what you say. And, no, I wouldn't underestimate the anger etc. 'against the side that fired the first shots'. The problem is, as virtually always in these things - who was that? You unravel the history and with every step back you find someone telling you they are only responding to an earlier attack.
Three things you've said. I disagree with all three. And I note the last one is gratuitous ad hominem. And that's why I'll have no further interaction with you. I will say I'm always very pleased by the way the most unpleasant people announce their presence in that way. Seems to be a sort of penchant of theirs. It saves a lot of time and trouble. Thank you. :)
It's not an ad hominen, it's an insult. I insulted you because you are a tedious midwit who repeats banalities under the false impression that you have anything to contribute.
The US isn't murdering civilians in Bucha and bombing buildings housing civilians in Ukraine. Russia is. Peace doesn't need to be "promoted": Russia needs to stop their war on Ukraine, stop killing Ukrainian civilians and citizens, stop invading its neighbors, stop supporting evil corrupt leaders like Putin, stop changing the subject, stop trying to justify the unjustifiable, and stop making excuses for its culture of lies and deceit.
The whole point is this illegal, unprovoked, unjustified war was started by and is owned by Russia, and it supported by the majority of Russians. The Russian people need to admit and reckon with that instead of trying to "But USA" their way out of responsibility.
The USA is doing it in Yemen, it recently finished doing it in Afghanistan, it did it in Iraq, Syria and Libya.
This war began in 2014 when the Minsk agreements were signed and the extreme elements of Ukraine immediately refused to allow them.
It was slowly 'cooked' by the USA etc over the intervening years, propaganda, arms, training, subversion, money, corruption the whole bit within Ukraine and steady and constant pressure on Russia.
Putin warned and warned and warned and nobody would listen.
People are not bad. It is useless blaming people.
When you or I say Russia or China or USA or Ukraine we shouldn't mean the people and we should never get it mixed up. We mean the manipulators of the people.
Now those manipulators are just as bad in the USA as they could possibly be in Russia and we know how bad they are in Ukraine. The corruption there is legendary.
The USA will not let Zelensky make peace. It's as simple as that. They will not let him.
And they foment civilian war which is totally criminal. Arming the people and suggesting they go fight. Madness.
And why would USA want to do such a thing? Just check history out. They've been doing it constantly forever, everywhere. Their whole foreign policy is to foment war and keep other nations weak.
Your friends should be Russia and Germany. Then there'd be a powerful machine in Europe that could put the world to shame.
The very thought frightens the pants off the Americans (remember, I don't mean the people, I mean their manipulators). They'll do anything to keep a wedge between those parties.
It's class international diplomacy since machiavellia in our literature and since forever in fact.
The USA does not control Zelensky. That's your Russian paranoia. The USA's position is that *Ukrainians* get to control Ukraine. It's as simple as that. But that's something that Russians cannot accept, because then you'll have to accept that the reasons your neighbors don't like you is because YOU keep killing them.
Russia could "make peace" tomorrow: by getting your child-killing troops out of Ukrainian territory and stop bombing Ukraine. It's simple as that.
The USA is not bombing Ukraine. The US is not bombing Russia. The US is not invading Russia. There is war in Ukraine because of one person and one country: Putin and Russia. Why? Because Putin is terrified of democracy, doesn't think Ukraine has a right to exist, and knows that if Ukraine ever has a functioning democracy he knows Russians will start asking why they too cannot be free.
Putin knows a democratic Ukraine means the end of his corrupt rule of lies, fear, hate, murder, manipulation, propaganda, and the paranoid USA-blame that prevents Russians from seeing Putin, not America, is the source of their problems.
We would be friends with Russia, like we are friends with Germany, if Russians joined the 21st century, stopping bombing and invading its neighbors, stopped the paranoid USAphobia, and accept that *Ukraine* has the right to control itself.
This war began with a Russian culture of hate, lies, paranoia, and warmongering that has existed for 500 years, from Ivan the Terrible, to Peter I, to Stalin, to Putin: a Russia that cannot accept its neighbor's right to self-determination, and a Russia that seeks to control, eat, and kill its neighbors and has been doing so long before the USA or NATO ever existed.
There is no pressure on Russia: NATO has never bombed or invaded Russia. Never. What Putin can't stand is democracy and freedom, and he desires to control and enslave Ukrainians (and Chechnyans and Georgians) like he controls and enslaves the Russian people with paranoid nonsense about the USA.
Putin has lied and murdered and lied and murdered and lied and murdered. If you were concerned about corruption, you'd be criticizing corrupt lying murderer Putin and his corrupt billionaire oligarchs robbing the Russian people.
If you were concerned about propaganda and manipulators, you'd be criticizing Putin for poisoning and murdering and jailing political opponents, arresting protestors, shutting down independent media, and blocking social media.
Russia's entire domestic and foreign policy is lies, violence, hatred of America, hatred of democracy, hatred of freedom, paranoia, murder, control, and slavery. And you'll do anything to stay in your paranoid blame the USA and blame everybody except Russians and their leader Putin for your failures and the fact that your neighbors want nothing to do with you.
Typical Russian: lies, lies, whataboutism, and more lies.
Setting aside the fact that USA has never made deliberate targeting, raping, and murdering of innocent civilians a standard part of war like Russia is doing: Russia did it in Grozny, in Aleppo, it's still doing it in Syria, it did it in Georgia, it did it in Chechnya, it's doing it Bucha, Mariupol, and the Kyiv suburbs in Ukraine. Putin did it to Nalvalny, to Litvinenko, to Nemstov.
But we know: it's never Putin's fault. It's never Russia's fault. There's always a deflection, always an excuse, always "let's change the subject to my hatred of Americans and anti-USA paranoia."
But the fact remains: this is Putin's war. The USA is not bombing Ukraine. Putin is. American troops are not raping Ukrainian women and murdering Ukrainian children, Russia is. And nobody is forcing them to commit these evil acts: they choose to.
I think it is an error for the Russian people to allow Putin to manipulate them with paranoid anti-USA propaganda instead of standing up to his culture of lies, hate, fear, and murder.
If history does not repeat itself it surely rhymes and in the case of Russia, it appears the country never learned from its history of lying since the revolution of 1905 and 1918. Further to this, Russia did not appear to learn from their WWII antagonist NAZI Germany which was also a power that turned to the "art of the lie" as a default position to manipulate the local population and a much wider audience around the world. Unfortunately for the modern-day liar who finds themselves living in a world where every cell phone is a virtual live-streaming camera of actual events as they happen to propel the truth on billions of phone or computer screens around the world instantly. The lie dies in the full light of truth until the "truthiness moderators" pull a "Hunter Biden laptop" disinformation and topic removal algorithm. The truth when you know does indeed set one free!
Another set of Russian "miscalculations." If they thought that this would make the Ukrainians make Russian a second legal language, I'd bet this will convince a LOT more Ukrainians to redouble their efforts to speak Ukrainian exclusively.
Not sure what they were thinking with Bucha, but nothing has brought many nations to view Russia as a criminal nation like what has been reported there. Total backfire.
Not sure why people believe that the missile that hit Kramatorsk could not have been fired by the Russians. Surely there are still some Tochkas in the Russian inventory, and it wouldn't take much effort to put a fake serial number on it.
" If they thought that this would make the Ukrainians make Russian a second legal language, I'd bet this will convince a LOT more Ukrainians to redouble their efforts to speak Ukrainian exclusively. " AND, this will be a long way to go for most of them as they still speak Russian (well, from Kentucky) most of the time, and think it too. Even after 30 years of independence. Putin made great inroads though. What a moron.
I'm embarrassed that I speak Russian better than Ukrainian, and am in the process of doing something about it. I read stuff in Ukrainian every day. A year ago I did it seldom, and almost always with a translator.
" justifying a declaration of war ..." Just what exactly is it that Russians have been doing since February 24? Looks an awful lot like a war, which is definitely a kind of a "special military operation." All wars and invasions are special military operations, the Normandy Invasion was a very special military operation. They weren't shooting teddy bears out of their artillery, and people were getting wounded and dying on the other end. It's rather like arguing with an alcoholic, you begin to feel a little crazy when they get you into the way which they see things, which is a crazy, screwed up way, with little or no connection to on-the-ground reality. Perhaps Vlad is a "king-sized" psychopath - and the "useful fools" who hang around him and make excuses and defend him are the sorts you always see around psychopaths and bullies, they're the enablers who pile on, if the think they see some perceived advantage. Usually the psychopath or bully treats them as disposable, they *know* they are disposable, and their character is so weak that they suck up continuously to the psychopath or bully. It's good to find out who these people actually are, because they're trash, and dangerous trash at that... It never fails to amaze me that so many American "conservatives" buy this Russian propaganda hook, line, and sinker - this is where politicization of issues gets you, averring the opposite of what your political opponent avers, without looking at the situation and giving it a good close examination can really lead you down the wrong path on this - and *I* was wrong in *my* initial assessment, until the English translation of Dugin's Foundations of Geopolitics came out - here, for reference: https://n01r.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/Foundations-of-Geopolitics-Geopolitical-Future-of-Russia-Alexander-Dugin-English-auto-translation-with-appended-original.pdf - if readers of this comment haven't read it, I suggest they do, and then pass it on to "conservative" friends who have been suckered by the Russians - it kicked my ass right out of bed, a literal "oh shit" moment... seeing that it had been written 25 years ago. Not only was this invasion unprovoked, it was *planned*, and extensively so, and Putin was just waiting for a weak American President to come along...
"It never fails to amaze me that so many American "conservatives" buy this Russian propaganda hook, line, and sinker."
Simple, because many conservatives are used to the total BS spouted by the democrats and their enablers in the press, on Covid, Racism, Sexuality, etc. The real shame is that we can't trust the media. Boy who cried wolf, and all that.
But then, the wolf really came along . . .
Weren't ppl supposed to have BRAINS? No, just knee jerks.
I don't know any of my conservative friends who spout Russian positions on this war. I see Carlson worried that the US will actively enter the war sending US troops. He asserts that those evil Democrats want to send troops. Worry about the prospect is fine because there is great public compassion for Ukraine's pain. But I think it unlikely given the stakes. And Trump's pronouncements are simply political in his belief that Putin would have behaved if Trump were in charge. That might actually be true but we shall never know. Clearly Putin underestimated Ukraine's resistance and could not have foreseen the world response to his invasion. The West has responded with a large supply of arms further enabling a real proxy war.
The politicians and media will do as they wish to sow division but I sense huge public support for Ukraine and not much for Putin. I suspect that the Russia public will eventually learn the truth given the scope of Russian losses. New dissidents are likely to arrive to replace those jailed by Putin. It's tragic what Putin has done to his people as well as his harms on Ukraine people. All because he wasn't winning in the Donbas.
Typical conservative: a noun a verb and tHe mEdiA!!11!! + it's the Democrats' fault that we're gullible idiots who believe fascists and liars. Funny how the "party of personal responsibility" will never take responsibility for their own failures. All of us have access to the same media, yet it's only Trump trash falling for Putin's bs. Hmmm.
Lying Republicans and their lying, racist Putin propagandists at Fox News have lied constantly about vaccines, about their white supremacy, about Trump's election loss, about the books and history they're banning.
The real shame is that right wing morons actually trust lying bigots like Tucker Carlson and Donald Trump. The good thing is young voters don't trust lying right wing media hacks, and that the GQP is finished once Boomer geriatrics die off over the next decade.
Sad to have such a bias. Lumping people under the vast generalization of conservative/liberal denies that few are all-in with any political stance.
Sad to be so lacking in decency and morals you're making desperate excuses for lying, white supremacist Putin-puppets like Donald Trump and Tucker Carlson, whose conservative propaganda is being played on Russian state TV to justify Putin's illegal war.
Imagine twisting yourself into knots to defend those two, then pretending to be against "generalization" when the Carlson-Trump Fox News right has turned demonized generalization of "liberals" and "the media" into a national sport. Spare me the phony, hypocritical selective outrage.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
well it's not news. it's a polemic against russians. and we don't need that. 99% of the citizens on both sides are good people, good enough anyway, normal, like you and I. And that needs to be remembered and peace needs to be promoted for their sakes. or at least for the sakes of their children.
the villain who do bad things are villains and you can abuse and vilify them.
But we don't need the fires of war stoked by the USA or anyone else
and we don't need whole peoples abused and condemned for what they've got little or no control over. It doesn't help a bit.
In fact it misses the whole point.
The whole point.
Lying is a theme that runs throughout Russian history. Every book I have reviewed discussed it. It has characterized most of the people who rose to power in Russia. This is not a matter of stoking fires, simply noting facts that many others have described. As we attempt to end this conflict, we have to understand our adversary as he is.
well that's it, right there: who is 'our adversary' ? Anyone advocating war, that's who.
Lying, I think you might find, is somewhat universal. England was known as 'perfidious Albion' I believe. That paragon of virtue and home of the mother of parliaments.
The USA currently has a truly exceptional list of lies to its name, I think.
The point, of course, is that neither the English nor the Americans - nor any other people - are really extraordinary or exceptional liars.
But of course you don't talk of the people, only of their 'leaders'.
Well I think the same can be said of them.
For it is a solid fact that diplomacy is the art of lying, of deception, is it not? You'd perhaps have read Coleman's 'Diplomacy by Deception' ?
My sole interest is to counter attempts to demonise whole peoples, is all. These wars are not of and by the people. Know it or not the people are merely manipulated puppets.
80%+ of the Russian people are in lockstep support of their lying, murderous leaders.
I wonder how you arrived at that statistic? I would imagine it compares with similar statistics around the world, like USA and Australia, that 80% of their people are in accord with their govt. actions re covid.
i.e. mainly an unfounded and worthless statistic.
When 'founded' it's generally founded on people who say 'yes' as a knee jerk reaction and pain avoidance strategy: don't contradict the prevailing narrative, don't talk about things you don't know about/care about, don't appear to have an argument with the govt.
BUT: even if all those people did condone the govt actions on covid (to stick to that parallel) it still wouldn't mean those people ARE as their government would it?
It wouldn't mean they would want to mask everyone in the clear absence of any proof of efficacy (the people are unaware of that). It wouldn't mean they want to ban use of proven medications. It wouldn't mean they want to spend billions and run up the national debt (most of them have no idea its happening) - would it?
They are not their leaders.
No people anywhere in the world are as their leaders are.
Your inference, whether you are aware of it or not, is that 80% of Russians are lying murderous people.
In the USA, Aus. etc, Covid context you'd claim 80% of those people were conniving, thieving, irrational, freedom destroying madmen. ( or women ).
Which they're not. You know that.
Hating a whole people ain't right and it don't fix.
I notice that you do not write "Most Russians oppose this war" or "Most Russians oppose Putin." You can't write that, because you know most Russians support Putin and his war. That makes them complicit, no matter how much you do not like it, because you don't like what that says about their lack of decency and morals.
"Hating a whole people" isn't me telling the uncomfortable truth about the viciousness, cruelty, and dishonesty in Russian culture under Putin that has led a supermajority of Russian people to support Putin's war.
"Hating a whole people" is what Russia's troops are doing to innocent civilians in Ukraine.
"In the USA, Aus.m etc, COVID context" is not relevant: the subject is Putin's evil, illegal war in Ukraine, not your desperate attempt to change the subject to deny the fact that most Russians support Putin, Putin's lies, Putin's hate, and Putin's violence.
That ~80% of Russians support Putin's vile actions is proven by polling and by the fact that Russians continue to vote for him. Again and again and again. Go to the @whitehouse Instagram page. Filled with comments from Russians in lockstep support of Putin.
Where are the Russians protesting the war? Where are the Russians planning to vote against Putin? Nowhere. We are waiting.
Every stray traveler to Mother Muscovy (Russia is a stolen term applied to this area since late 18th century) attested no morals and nor scruples, blatant lying and stealing and robbing, along with murder, whenever convenient. Same as did most of Russian writers of the 19th century (the 1st century of Russian literature). Just like Russian soldiers did traditionally, and continue to do at EVERY opportunity. And yet, here we are again, mulling the enigma of the Russian soul. I say it as a matter of fact, with no ill intent.
" . . . and we don't need whole peoples abused and condemned for what they've got little or no control over."
I understand where you are coming from, and my guts are turning over every time I see images of the carnage. I cross myself and say 'Lord have Mercy' for every life that has been lost. I also understand that, in order to be able to kill the enemy, one must first dehumanize them. "Ukrainians are Nazis." "Russians are subhuman monsters." Etc. ad nauseum.
Simple folks like you and I (and every Ukrainian refugee I've met in Germany) want this stopped as soon as possible. We just want to go home.
But don't underestimate the anger and justifiable desire for revenge against the side that fired the first shots.
It's true what you say. And, no, I wouldn't underestimate the anger etc. 'against the side that fired the first shots'. The problem is, as virtually always in these things - who was that? You unravel the history and with every step back you find someone telling you they are only responding to an earlier attack.
Isn't it so?
'Isn't it so?' No. It isn't so. Sometimes one side is the aggressor and one side isn't. Your moral equivalence posturing is pretentious and tedious.
Three things you've said. I disagree with all three. And I note the last one is gratuitous ad hominem. And that's why I'll have no further interaction with you. I will say I'm always very pleased by the way the most unpleasant people announce their presence in that way. Seems to be a sort of penchant of theirs. It saves a lot of time and trouble. Thank you. :)
It's not an ad hominen, it's an insult. I insulted you because you are a tedious midwit who repeats banalities under the false impression that you have anything to contribute.
The US isn't murdering civilians in Bucha and bombing buildings housing civilians in Ukraine. Russia is. Peace doesn't need to be "promoted": Russia needs to stop their war on Ukraine, stop killing Ukrainian civilians and citizens, stop invading its neighbors, stop supporting evil corrupt leaders like Putin, stop changing the subject, stop trying to justify the unjustifiable, and stop making excuses for its culture of lies and deceit.
The whole point is this illegal, unprovoked, unjustified war was started by and is owned by Russia, and it supported by the majority of Russians. The Russian people need to admit and reckon with that instead of trying to "But USA" their way out of responsibility.
The USA is doing it in Yemen, it recently finished doing it in Afghanistan, it did it in Iraq, Syria and Libya.
This war began in 2014 when the Minsk agreements were signed and the extreme elements of Ukraine immediately refused to allow them.
It was slowly 'cooked' by the USA etc over the intervening years, propaganda, arms, training, subversion, money, corruption the whole bit within Ukraine and steady and constant pressure on Russia.
Putin warned and warned and warned and nobody would listen.
People are not bad. It is useless blaming people.
When you or I say Russia or China or USA or Ukraine we shouldn't mean the people and we should never get it mixed up. We mean the manipulators of the people.
Now those manipulators are just as bad in the USA as they could possibly be in Russia and we know how bad they are in Ukraine. The corruption there is legendary.
The USA will not let Zelensky make peace. It's as simple as that. They will not let him.
And they foment civilian war which is totally criminal. Arming the people and suggesting they go fight. Madness.
And why would USA want to do such a thing? Just check history out. They've been doing it constantly forever, everywhere. Their whole foreign policy is to foment war and keep other nations weak.
Your friends should be Russia and Germany. Then there'd be a powerful machine in Europe that could put the world to shame.
The very thought frightens the pants off the Americans (remember, I don't mean the people, I mean their manipulators). They'll do anything to keep a wedge between those parties.
It's class international diplomacy since machiavellia in our literature and since forever in fact.
The USA does not control Zelensky. That's your Russian paranoia. The USA's position is that *Ukrainians* get to control Ukraine. It's as simple as that. But that's something that Russians cannot accept, because then you'll have to accept that the reasons your neighbors don't like you is because YOU keep killing them.
Russia could "make peace" tomorrow: by getting your child-killing troops out of Ukrainian territory and stop bombing Ukraine. It's simple as that.
The USA is not bombing Ukraine. The US is not bombing Russia. The US is not invading Russia. There is war in Ukraine because of one person and one country: Putin and Russia. Why? Because Putin is terrified of democracy, doesn't think Ukraine has a right to exist, and knows that if Ukraine ever has a functioning democracy he knows Russians will start asking why they too cannot be free.
Putin knows a democratic Ukraine means the end of his corrupt rule of lies, fear, hate, murder, manipulation, propaganda, and the paranoid USA-blame that prevents Russians from seeing Putin, not America, is the source of their problems.
We would be friends with Russia, like we are friends with Germany, if Russians joined the 21st century, stopping bombing and invading its neighbors, stopped the paranoid USAphobia, and accept that *Ukraine* has the right to control itself.
This war began with a Russian culture of hate, lies, paranoia, and warmongering that has existed for 500 years, from Ivan the Terrible, to Peter I, to Stalin, to Putin: a Russia that cannot accept its neighbor's right to self-determination, and a Russia that seeks to control, eat, and kill its neighbors and has been doing so long before the USA or NATO ever existed.
There is no pressure on Russia: NATO has never bombed or invaded Russia. Never. What Putin can't stand is democracy and freedom, and he desires to control and enslave Ukrainians (and Chechnyans and Georgians) like he controls and enslaves the Russian people with paranoid nonsense about the USA.
Putin has lied and murdered and lied and murdered and lied and murdered. If you were concerned about corruption, you'd be criticizing corrupt lying murderer Putin and his corrupt billionaire oligarchs robbing the Russian people.
If you were concerned about propaganda and manipulators, you'd be criticizing Putin for poisoning and murdering and jailing political opponents, arresting protestors, shutting down independent media, and blocking social media.
Russia's entire domestic and foreign policy is lies, violence, hatred of America, hatred of democracy, hatred of freedom, paranoia, murder, control, and slavery. And you'll do anything to stay in your paranoid blame the USA and blame everybody except Russians and their leader Putin for your failures and the fact that your neighbors want nothing to do with you.
Typical Russian: lies, lies, whataboutism, and more lies.
Setting aside the fact that USA has never made deliberate targeting, raping, and murdering of innocent civilians a standard part of war like Russia is doing: Russia did it in Grozny, in Aleppo, it's still doing it in Syria, it did it in Georgia, it did it in Chechnya, it's doing it Bucha, Mariupol, and the Kyiv suburbs in Ukraine. Putin did it to Nalvalny, to Litvinenko, to Nemstov.
But we know: it's never Putin's fault. It's never Russia's fault. There's always a deflection, always an excuse, always "let's change the subject to my hatred of Americans and anti-USA paranoia."
But the fact remains: this is Putin's war. The USA is not bombing Ukraine. Putin is. American troops are not raping Ukrainian women and murdering Ukrainian children, Russia is. And nobody is forcing them to commit these evil acts: they choose to.
I sympathise with your evident hurt and the rage you feel because of it. However I think you are in error to hate a whole people.
I think it is an error for the Russian people to allow Putin to manipulate them with paranoid anti-USA propaganda instead of standing up to his culture of lies, hate, fear, and murder.
The taste of Russian medicine is bitter. Usually deadly too. Welcome to the club!
If history does not repeat itself it surely rhymes and in the case of Russia, it appears the country never learned from its history of lying since the revolution of 1905 and 1918. Further to this, Russia did not appear to learn from their WWII antagonist NAZI Germany which was also a power that turned to the "art of the lie" as a default position to manipulate the local population and a much wider audience around the world. Unfortunately for the modern-day liar who finds themselves living in a world where every cell phone is a virtual live-streaming camera of actual events as they happen to propel the truth on billions of phone or computer screens around the world instantly. The lie dies in the full light of truth until the "truthiness moderators" pull a "Hunter Biden laptop" disinformation and topic removal algorithm. The truth when you know does indeed set one free!
Another set of Russian "miscalculations." If they thought that this would make the Ukrainians make Russian a second legal language, I'd bet this will convince a LOT more Ukrainians to redouble their efforts to speak Ukrainian exclusively.
Not sure what they were thinking with Bucha, but nothing has brought many nations to view Russia as a criminal nation like what has been reported there. Total backfire.
Not sure why people believe that the missile that hit Kramatorsk could not have been fired by the Russians. Surely there are still some Tochkas in the Russian inventory, and it wouldn't take much effort to put a fake serial number on it.
" If they thought that this would make the Ukrainians make Russian a second legal language, I'd bet this will convince a LOT more Ukrainians to redouble their efforts to speak Ukrainian exclusively. " AND, this will be a long way to go for most of them as they still speak Russian (well, from Kentucky) most of the time, and think it too. Even after 30 years of independence. Putin made great inroads though. What a moron.
I'm embarrassed that I speak Russian better than Ukrainian, and am in the process of doing something about it. I read stuff in Ukrainian every day. A year ago I did it seldom, and almost always with a translator.